Thanks to everyone involved in the stirling efforts of mediation, not an easy task taking on a giant such as Adobe. With many, many years of clients' work invested in Freehand, I for one will be waiting for news of plan B
ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
Re: ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
Opened the email this morning and read with great sadness, I had hoped Freehand would indeed be Free but it appears that's not the case and the offer of a discount just a bitter pill to swallow.
Thanks to everyone involved in the stirling efforts of mediation, not an easy task taking on a giant such as Adobe. With many, many years of clients' work invested in Freehand, I for one will be waiting for news of plan B
Thanks to everyone involved in the stirling efforts of mediation, not an easy task taking on a giant such as Adobe. With many, many years of clients' work invested in Freehand, I for one will be waiting for news of plan B
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saschabierl
- Posts: 12
- Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:02 pm
- Location: Berlin
- Contact:
Re: ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
Yes sad, but honestly, this was quite sure to happen, as freeing Freehand would have meant that Adobe lets out AIs mighty competitor.
Necessary right now is to define a catalogue of the Freehand´s features that everyone of us needs the most.
If Adobe will implement these features to AI, maybe we have an alternative to Freehand - but I doubt that they will.
In this case a new application has to be build, because one thing is for sure: I will never use AI for my illustrational work, I need the tool I choosed to work with, the tool that fits to me. Even if this means to keep an old Mac running OSX 10.6 until the day I quit working.
At last a huge Thank you to everybody at FFH for your work! Yet, I´m wondering why there is the argument, that a further trial would produce too many costs? Nobody asked us to give a certain amount for that. I mean, 6500 people gave 8000 US$ yet! Imagine everybody spending 10 US$!!!
Necessary right now is to define a catalogue of the Freehand´s features that everyone of us needs the most.
If Adobe will implement these features to AI, maybe we have an alternative to Freehand - but I doubt that they will.
In this case a new application has to be build, because one thing is for sure: I will never use AI for my illustrational work, I need the tool I choosed to work with, the tool that fits to me. Even if this means to keep an old Mac running OSX 10.6 until the day I quit working.
At last a huge Thank you to everybody at FFH for your work! Yet, I´m wondering why there is the argument, that a further trial would produce too many costs? Nobody asked us to give a certain amount for that. I mean, 6500 people gave 8000 US$ yet! Imagine everybody spending 10 US$!!!
Re: ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
$199 discount off of $729 I guess is better than a kick in the teeth, but it's still way out of my price range, and to buy a program that I dislike! I don't feel this discount really helps since you have to buy a new license, and it's not valid for upgrades. You also need a FH license number. I had that up until a short while ago when I gave it the toss.
Re: ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
Sad day indeed.
Well done FFH team for taking it this far but it's game over now for FreeHand, given what you've been forced to agree. Supporting Snow Leopard, Rosetta and our beloved friend in the long term just isn't viable.
It's a travesty and we can only hope the community pulls together (see the Kickstater thread http://freefreehand.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=638). As much as it pains us to say it, it looks like we do in fact need a new vector app if Adobe won't release the codebase as Illustrator will never be FreeHand.
Well done FFH team for taking it this far but it's game over now for FreeHand, given what you've been forced to agree. Supporting Snow Leopard, Rosetta and our beloved friend in the long term just isn't viable.
It's a travesty and we can only hope the community pulls together (see the Kickstater thread http://freefreehand.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=638). As much as it pains us to say it, it looks like we do in fact need a new vector app if Adobe won't release the codebase as Illustrator will never be FreeHand.
Re: ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
Many thanks for all the effort although I too am disappointed with the outcome. Maybe Adobe could bundle a "freebie" upgraded Freehand alongside Illustrator ..... ? That way they would probably increase their Illustrator sales!
Re: ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
Free FreeHand's story over the last few years is notable and something FreeHand users can be proud of. We took it farther than was conceivable in 2009 when the mission back then was to get Adobe's attention to find a solution for FreeHand users. Too bad it took legal action for a listening ear.
Regardless of the legal wording in the settlement announcement, what is important is that meetings will be happening with the Illustrator team. This is significant to present what could benefit FreeHand users AND Illustrator users (whether they realise it or not.) FreeHand can influence Illustrator for the better and it is a diamond that Adobe has yet to fully appreciate.
In fact, I see several of you are already presenting changes and features in Illustrator and I highly recommend MORE! If you have a desired change, submit it to add to our list of priorities. I believe the AI development team is anxious to talk with us and compare notes.
And, there is more to come as FFH.org can finally transition from its legal posturing and protest to other avenues that are non-Adobe related and can benefit us as users.
—Mark
Regardless of the legal wording in the settlement announcement, what is important is that meetings will be happening with the Illustrator team. This is significant to present what could benefit FreeHand users AND Illustrator users (whether they realise it or not.) FreeHand can influence Illustrator for the better and it is a diamond that Adobe has yet to fully appreciate.
In fact, I see several of you are already presenting changes and features in Illustrator and I highly recommend MORE! If you have a desired change, submit it to add to our list of priorities. I believe the AI development team is anxious to talk with us and compare notes.
And, there is more to come as FFH.org can finally transition from its legal posturing and protest to other avenues that are non-Adobe related and can benefit us as users.
—Mark
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devils kitchen
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:11 pm
Re: ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
I would like to thank everyone at Free Freehand for their efforts over the last couple of years: I would imagine that every member of this movement would acknowledge that wringing any concession from the corporate behemoth that Adobe has become is a victory of sorts.
However, that does not alter the fact that the email that I received was a disappointing one: a discount off Illustrator is simply not acceptable.
Why?
For the same reasons that Adobe decided to kill Freehand: because Freehand was not simply a competitor to Illustrator, but to InDesign too.
Let us leave aside the fact that Freehand's UI was innovative and responsive in a way that Illustrator's has not: let us instead acknowledge that Freehand had all of the DTP power of InDesign (and Quark before that). It had features that do not exist in InDesign even now.
For some years now, I have been making an active effort to replace Adobe products in my workflow. Whilst I admit that my gradual re-emphasis on web technologies (rather than print) has changed my requirements, I have found some Mac OS X applications that substantially cover almost everything that I need to do.
Pixelmator: whilst no Photoshop, it is entirely adequate for most of my needs. Cost: £20 in the Mac App Store.
As a vector drawing application, I have found that Sketch (by Bohemian Coding) shares many of Freehand's best features—including a responsive UI. Cost: £35 in the Mac App Store.
Neither of these applications are as fully developed as Photoshop, Illustrator or Freehand. However, they also cost a fraction of the price—and they are being updated regularly. I would urge Free Freehand members to throw their weight behind these applications.
What I haven't found is a good equivalent of Freehand's DTP features—although I am trialling a number of applications.
I hope that an upstart will bring something to market in much the same way as the makers of Pixelmator and Sketch have done.
However, that does not alter the fact that the email that I received was a disappointing one: a discount off Illustrator is simply not acceptable.
Why?
For the same reasons that Adobe decided to kill Freehand: because Freehand was not simply a competitor to Illustrator, but to InDesign too.
Let us leave aside the fact that Freehand's UI was innovative and responsive in a way that Illustrator's has not: let us instead acknowledge that Freehand had all of the DTP power of InDesign (and Quark before that). It had features that do not exist in InDesign even now.
For some years now, I have been making an active effort to replace Adobe products in my workflow. Whilst I admit that my gradual re-emphasis on web technologies (rather than print) has changed my requirements, I have found some Mac OS X applications that substantially cover almost everything that I need to do.
Pixelmator: whilst no Photoshop, it is entirely adequate for most of my needs. Cost: £20 in the Mac App Store.
As a vector drawing application, I have found that Sketch (by Bohemian Coding) shares many of Freehand's best features—including a responsive UI. Cost: £35 in the Mac App Store.
Neither of these applications are as fully developed as Photoshop, Illustrator or Freehand. However, they also cost a fraction of the price—and they are being updated regularly. I would urge Free Freehand members to throw their weight behind these applications.
What I haven't found is a good equivalent of Freehand's DTP features—although I am trialling a number of applications.
I hope that an upstart will bring something to market in much the same way as the makers of Pixelmator and Sketch have done.
Re: ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
Oh, man! I was really hoping for Freehand to be updated even just a little bit. Just enough to be a little bit compatible with other design/publishing programs and the latest Mac OS, because I believe those are the only updates it needs. It works perfectly as is. I guess the days of 'super-fast layouts' are numbered. Illustrator is just too slow and stupid for me. But I hope there would still be a solution. I'll use Freehand on Snow Leopard as long as I could!
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saschabierl
- Posts: 12
- Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:02 pm
- Location: Berlin
- Contact:
Re: ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
FFH Mark wrote:In fact, I see several of you are already presenting changes and features in Illustrator and I highly recommend MORE! If you have a desired change, submit it to add to our list of priorities. I believe the AI development team is anxious to talk with us and compare notes.
Mark, is there a way for you to make this list public, for everyone of us to see? I miss a list describing all the features that Freehand has and AI misses. Also I find it hard to name these features as well in english as I could in german.
(for example that you can grab a line with the pointer anywhere between the points and bend it … genius and not to find in AI!)
Let´s keep fighting! Viva Freehand!!
Sascha
Re: ADOBE MEDIATION RESULT
This is sad -- another typical screw job by Adobe -- and it would be completely unacceptable if we didn't have to kowtow to Adobe and their insolent corporate crap.
(1) So glad they'll waste more of our time by participating in four meetings. Of course, no assurances that they'll be LISTENING to our concerns, or IMPLEMENTING our suggestions. Sounds like four luncheon dates, and a polite and dismissive "thank you very much." We won't see one feature implemented (yes, you can quote me). And one of the most important issues -- Freehand's speed and sleekness -- is something that is simply impossible to implement in such bloatware as Illustrator.
(2) The discount is unmitigated marketing crap. If they're going to be "magnanimous" and offer a discount, it should be for ALL purchases of Illustrator to qualifying members -- not just for the 3 special cases for items that they're not currently selling enough of. This is just unbearably insulting -- a chance for marketing to sell more copies of an inferior product and co-opt a little more market share when they already have a monopoly.
I am so appreciative of all your dedication and hard work in going up against this unresponsive and uncaring Goliath. While I am saddened and angry at the outcome, I am certainly not surprised. Adobe hasn't listened to its customers for a very, very long time. This is just another instance of their corporate hubris.
I am, however, interested to see what might be the "new steps" and "new course" you refer to in this saga. Seems to me that the only possible recourse is to write a new "Freehand" that's sleek and responsive and kicks the crap out of Illustrator.
Thanks again for your efforts. Standing by to see what's next!
(1) So glad they'll waste more of our time by participating in four meetings. Of course, no assurances that they'll be LISTENING to our concerns, or IMPLEMENTING our suggestions. Sounds like four luncheon dates, and a polite and dismissive "thank you very much." We won't see one feature implemented (yes, you can quote me). And one of the most important issues -- Freehand's speed and sleekness -- is something that is simply impossible to implement in such bloatware as Illustrator.
(2) The discount is unmitigated marketing crap. If they're going to be "magnanimous" and offer a discount, it should be for ALL purchases of Illustrator to qualifying members -- not just for the 3 special cases for items that they're not currently selling enough of. This is just unbearably insulting -- a chance for marketing to sell more copies of an inferior product and co-opt a little more market share when they already have a monopoly.
I am so appreciative of all your dedication and hard work in going up against this unresponsive and uncaring Goliath. While I am saddened and angry at the outcome, I am certainly not surprised. Adobe hasn't listened to its customers for a very, very long time. This is just another instance of their corporate hubris.
I am, however, interested to see what might be the "new steps" and "new course" you refer to in this saga. Seems to me that the only possible recourse is to write a new "Freehand" that's sleek and responsive and kicks the crap out of Illustrator.
Thanks again for your efforts. Standing by to see what's next!